When Jackie was in the first grade, she found herself dealing with gender confusion and wishing that she could be a boy. At age 17, she began pursuing her attraction to women. A few years later, she felt that God was convicting her of her current lifestyle. Jackie is now married to a wonderful man and has a new baby! Join us as we hear from Jackie about how Christ, the church and fellow Christians helped her as she walked away from a homosexual lifestyle.

hey there welcome to the program today

I’m really glad that you’re here I want

you to just get comfortable and hang out

with me for a little while as we talk

about something that I really do think

it’s important that we have a

conversation about around here you know

the topic that we’re going to address

tonight most of the time we’ve just hear

arguments about it and tick antagonism

toward it and we’re just all trying to

find our way and you might have someone

in your life personally that is dealing

with this issue so I think it’s

important for us to get as much

information as we can so we can be as

sensitive as we can

I’ll tell you all the details about it

in just second stay tuned

yeah I am Priscilla welcome I hope that

you have already seen part one of the

program that we are in today this is

part two of a conversation we’re having

with a woman who I just like her I like

her name is Jackie Hill peri and she has

been so authentic with us and so

vulnerable and open and in doing so I

know that she’s helping a lot of people

she sure is helping me so I wonder if

you guys would help me to welcome her

back to the program again today thank

you so much I’m glad that you’re here

we were talking about your inclination

toward an attraction for women through

and gender confusion and this started

not when you were you know 20 you can

remember being a kid oh four and five

years old and having these these

feelings news I want to ask you about

the gender confusion just a little bit

was there ever time were you and you may

have been too young to get to this point

before the Lord kind of met you and and

changed the trajectory of your life but

did you ever think I might want to

actually undergo whatever is necessary

to live as a man no and I think I think

I was young but also that type of thing

wasn’t popular you know like I didn’t

see that on TV or like like we do now

because this is I was four and like 95

and so I was like Oh 95 it was it was so

far along yeah I’m sorry but um y’all

just made me feel like oh you’re not

though okay this is all right thank you

yeah so no I didn’t I think I think that

comes with the knowledge of that being

actually possible you know so do you

think that just the knowledge of it is

what separates those who might walk down

that path from those who just choose to

be a star possibly and then that’s not

popular in the black community the black

gay community you don’t see a lot of

that is just I’m a stud or trans but not

trans in the sense of I’ve changed I’ve

had sex changes you just kind of put on

the clothes and the demeanor and that’s

it I think it’s a lot more dominant and

the predominant in the

Cajun community and I could be wrong but

that’s what it seems that’s what it

appears to be yeah so you 17 18 years

old you have a girlfriend

yep a lot a few a few yes your mom finds

out uh-huh in a very you just were set

up that day in the car yeah so your mom

finds out and how did your relationship

dynamics change after that it changed a

lot and it wasn’t just the homosexuality

thing it was like I was doing that and I

was just super rebellious and so so

wasn’t just that it was an old teenage

thing happening yeah it was just I was

just rude I was just ignorant

I just got high all the time was getting

arrested and so it’s like whoo I could

tell my mom was like who is this person

I really don’t know who this person is

and so she says we just didn’t like each

other honestly it’s just we were walk in

the house and not speak to each other

and then it got weird because now all of

my friends that may not even be my

girlfriends are suspect it’s like yeah

y’all can go in the room they can’t be

there when I’m not there like if y’all

on the couch I need to sit on that couch

in that couch it was just it got like

it’s like but I know her sister grade

school was like I don’t know that though

yeah it was just weird

yeah and is it still weird oh it’s

amazing

it’s amazing yeah so there have been a

lot of things that have changed in you

okay go here so people think that just

the if we encourage people if you sell

miss sofa and encourage someone who’s

struggling with this to know that it can

change that they can desire the opposite

sex the Lord can literally change their

desires you Bice by suggesting that

you’re also implying that who they feel

like they just naturally are is just

wrong it is sin it deserves it sounds so

harsh because this is just like you said

it wasn’t like you you chose you just

woke up one day at 20 and decided you

know what I’m going to be gay you’re

saying when you were 4 this is just the

way you were been yeah so for someone

who’s just they’re watching and they’re

thinking I don’t even know I don’t even

know what

be like to be attracted to a man yeah to

suggest to them that their desire can be

changed is also implying that this is

sin this is wrong and is that what you

feel emphatically that it’s just wrong

it’s not just your lifestyle or the way

you feel yeah it’s just straight-up

wrong it is and and and that’s hard when

it seems so natural but I always like to

use this example of children it’s like

when you see a two three four year old

they are just some bad people with you

know like they’re rude sometimes and

they’re sweet and every day and their

self you don’t have to train them how to

lie they just lie and that’s who they

are like it’s saying right but it’s like

as parents and as adults

we’re called to train them into

discipline though this is how you feel

right now that is not how you behave and

I think when we look at God the Father

it’s like no that’s how you feel that is

not how you behave this is another way

there is another way if you just trust

me and so just because it may feel

natural doesn’t mean that it’s honorable

and I think that’s what needs to be

understood it’s just this whole and

original sin thing and so we can get

that then we don’t understand why we do

the things we do nor can we understand

the regeneration and salvation needs to

happen for you to change do you think

that you can minimize this this in

eighth feeling this an eighth need that

every human being has to be in

relationship with another human being do

you think in a sense where you’re

minimizing it when you compare it to

telling a lie or being selfish or

something that is yeah it’s a dangerous

it’s a dangerous way to live your life

but it’s not this innate human desire

that we all have to live with another

person because for some person you might

be saying okay listen this is wrong

homosexuality is wrong yeah so if you

choose not to live a homosexual

lifestyle you are also choosing possibly

to remain single for the rest of your

life yeah you’re making that choice that

is a hard yeah it is and I know that

everyone’s story will not be mine I

think I was called to marriage and so

God just empowered me to love

my husband into love Preston but I know

plenty of believers that will come out

of the homosexual lifestyle that are

called to a life of celibacy and are

gifted with the gift of singleness and

they are content in that but I think we

don’t preach about singleness enough

where we see like the end-all be-all is

not marriage because it’s not

relationship I think the fact that we

won’t have a marriage in heaven is a big

thing but we will see and know God and

so I think though it may be hard to

think about man you’re telling me I

can’t love someone intimately for the

rest of my life if that is the cross

that you have to bear you have to reckon

with is God worth it if he’s worth it

then be willing to submit to that but

God is also faithful he’ll impart he’ll

empower you to do things at our heart he

really will he’ll empower you to do

things that you deem impossible exactly

hard but impossible

exactly which would have been your case

yeah because you could have it when you

were 18 19 could you have ever thought

that you would ever be not only just in

a relationship with a man but married to

a man I wanted to be but I didn’t think

I would like it I just I wanted to be

married theoretically but I didn’t think

it would be something I enjoy because

you didn’t even like male company much

or it wasn’t just because of the sexual

attraction like a nail niss so see

that’s that’s kind of weird to me

because you’re saying that in becoming a

stud you wanted to kind of carry that

maleness in your person but you didn’t

want you didn’t like it inside fusing

other ladies it can’t help us to get

away no again it’s because it’s like you

become which your which you don’t like I

don’t even explain it I should write

about it and figure it out myself so I

could explain it being out first before

you write about okay okay I’ll write it

out processing myself

yeah that’s not interesting but beards

their stomachs were hard big hands hairy

I just didn’t like it it wasn’t like

that

that’s gross to me I like the softness

and of women um no I like it I still

don’t like too much airiness but

precedents are here so we good

oh damn it’s the best the best okay yeah

okay so the Lord changed your desires

okay

so you’ve just clearly said just a

second ago that you are not suggesting

that everyone who is honest with about

their life and brings it to the foot of

the cross that God is going to

necessarily give them the desire for the

opposite set no they’re saying that the

answer might be that he gives you the

gift of celibacy and singleness it makes

you content that God will give you a

desire for him and in you living for him

he may will that you be with the

opposite sex or he may call you to just

live in community with other believers

and just live your life unto his glory

it’s possible would you have been

willing to do that it with the help of

the Holy Ghost yes but just me no like I

was like I don’t want I didn’t want to I

want it to be which I wanted children I

wanted to be with someone and I think

most people do that’s why it is

difficult mm-hmm and you have a baby

yes honeymoon baby I’m sorry what

happened honeymoon baby literally my

entire marriage I was pregnant whole

first year the whole first year so you

got pregnant on your honeymoon yep on a

cruise we were just set up to fail when

you’re gonna cruise you would same room

for like six days I mean you’re supposed

he’s your husband you’re supposed to be

in the same room I know but it just and

you set up and then you’ve been saved

and you ain’t did nothing with nobody so

just it was a beautiful time well you

know it really is great that you’re

saying yet it was a beautiful time if

you loved it it would disgust you I did

it yeah so it was my the thing with

Preston though that’s my husband it was

not easy it wasn’t oh my gosh I like

this dude it really wasn’t that I mean

you’re courting you mean when you met

and/or you mean the marriage the

marriage the courtship that was our

courtship and our marriage was difficult

because it was unearthing all of these

issues that I had towards men and so I

just was really mean

for a long time and distrusting and

unwilling to be vulnerable but he

continued to pursue me did he know all

of this stuff and how you don’t seem

like you hold much I don’t

maybe you gonna take me for what I am

yeah we just so it’s like first date you

just the first time we met because I was

doing poetry in LA and he was doing

poetry and my poem was called my life as

a stud which was my testimony his poem

was about him sleeping with every women

that could every woman that could

breathe and so the first time we met was

us hearing our testimonies and so that

just became the root of our friendship

was just this realness and this honesty

is that dude is cool and that girl is

cool and and and so you’re the poem that

he heard did it did your poem end in a

way that showed that you had left that

lifestyle okay so he knew that that’s

not where you were at him yeah that’s

where you had been yeah and he didn’t

care no to him it

he said that attracted him so much

because he loves authentic people and he

was like this girl has our dasa t to be

on this stage talking about all this I

want to meet her I want to know her and

then when I when he introduced himself

to me I corrected him on his poem and he

was like people don’t usually come at me

like that when they first meet me so

that just was like I like her yeah she’s

not she’s not fake so and when you found

out that he was interested in you

romantically what was your first kind of

physical response to that were you kind

of like our story is because we were

friends for three years okay just plain

old friends but when two weeks prior to

him admitting how he felt I had liked

him for a year an entire year I just

started to have these affections and

attractions for him and I was just like

Lord and my just bored and my thirsty do

I just want somebody to text I don’t so

you were confused it was shocking you

that you were feeling this yeah yeah I

just cuz I just thought I don’t like him

I not guarding my heart this is this is

the first time I had liked other guys

but I didn’t like them like I liked

Preston because when I started to like

Preston it was I started to like him

because he was reversing everything I

had beliefs

about men he was a complete opposite he

was honest he was caring he was

consistent he loved Jesus he paid

attention to details like I didn’t I

didn’t think men were like that

I thought only women were like that and

so that kind of started it and then so

it came to a point where I was like you

know what Lord I never let him know I

liked them because I just didn’t feel

like that was my place to to flirt with

him or something like that and so I took

it to the Lord I said Lord if it’s meant

for me and Preston to be together you

have to do that let your will be done

but if it’s your will for us to just be

friends help me handle my affections

rightly so I treat him like a brother

and not a crush two weeks later he

called me like you know what I don’t

even know if you like me but I just feel

like I’m supposed to pursue you do you

like me

and I was like yeah I do he was like oh

I didn’t even know and that he was like

that built so much respect for me

because he was like all of the women

that liked him always let him know and

so it never put him in a position where

he could lead and pursue mom and so it’s

just really weird yeah yes it’s a good

story though it’s a good story we’re

going to talk more about it because I do

want to know you know real honestly how

if marriage is hard just because of the

desires that you have had for your whole

life up until now yeah and what that

looks like for someone who’s making the

choice the courageous choice that you’ve

made to follow and honor God with your

life but in reality what that sometimes

might look like so we’re going to talk

more about that we’ll be back in just a

couple minutes

hi I’m Priscilla and I wanted to take an

opportunity to invite you personally to

join me for a seventh session Bible

study on the armor of God will dive

deeply into what it means to be equipped

to stand firm against the schemes of the

enemy he is very real and he has been so

strategic and targeted in his attacks

against us why shouldn’t we be equally

strategic than targeted in standing firm

against him and you and I have an

opportunity to suit up to put on some

armor that works and to go to battle and

to see victory declared in our lives and

the lives of those people that we have

this Bible study will be one that will

change our lives forever and will help

us to walk in victory so plan to join me

won’t in the armor of God

welcome back rhaggy was still joining us

and jackie still here she’s still

filling us in on all the details that we

need to know about her life but then the

broader issue – which is so important

for us to deal with I want to talk about

marriage yes you’re married now for a

year you have a sweet little baby boy

girl baby girl what is her name

Eden grace Eden grip that’s a good name

in that a good name

Eden grace loved that so much and is she

bubbly what’s her personality is she

kind of ah I think she’s like me yeah

she can be real fun and then just real

just like ratchet I don’t know that’s

where yet okay now more time but just

know we’re not gonna say she’s fickle is

the work what do you mean just I don’t

want you to hold me this way I want you

to hold me this way I don’t want to lay

down that way I want to lay on my side

it’s like a little picky yeah yeah I’m

the same way oh are you saying she’s

sleeping through the night yet for two

days she did this morning she woke up at

2:30 and 6:30 yeah

so you’re tired a lot yeah I gotta sleep

tonight though good and for you tell us

about marriage and what that looks like

for you in terms of dealing with the

reality mm-hmm

that your desires were your desires in

some way they probably I mean they

didn’t just magically leave it’s

something you’re having to walk out in

obedience to the Lord is he sanctifies

you by a spirit but still you’re living

in your body yeah I mean so are there

are there you know tough days where

you’re having to make conscious choices

you know that are antagonistic towards

the way you’re feeling rarely and that’s

because I think as I’ve been walking

with the Lord almost eight years now the

first few years were very difficult it

was a lot of just constant choosing and

fleeing and just turning my head and

thinking on things that are good and

pure but I think as I just got

discipleship and holistic discipleship

dealing with greed and laziness and

stewardship and sorry just about the

homosexuality that was about all of it

all of it and

when I just learned gospel centricity

and learning how to just flow into that

in all areas of my life it temptations

became less burdensome that’s a good way

and also less what’s the word

discouraging because I came to a place

where I saw that temptations are a

normal part of the Christian experience

because I in the black church well I

won’t say black church but in the church

sometimes deliverance is communicated as

the absence of a temptation right so

it’s like God is gonna save you and you

just and it’s like that’s not true yeah

um in Christ I will have temptations and

that is completely and absolutely normal

but I don’t have to be discouraged by

them because God has promised to help me

that is exactly right and so with that

it’s like if I do see a woman that’s

beautiful it’s like yes she’s beautiful

but I choose not to look at her and I’m

not fazed by it it is still a conscious

choice though that you have to make yes

yeah and I think that’s so I think

that’s so important that you’re

communicating that because I think we

feel like in any any sort of addiction

any you know whether it’s drug or or

alcoholism we think there is a moment

this magic moment when something’s

supposed to happen and then we’ll never

be attracted to that again and you’re

saying that’s not necessarily the case

it is that I know I’m free in Christ but

now I’m having to consciously choose to

walk that way yeah and and and it

becomes possible when you’re just

feeding yourself with God and the sense

of like if I understand and know that

God is better then these things will be

though they’re attractive they will be

less attractive they won’t overpower me

or control me it’s just like yeah let me

think of the consequences look at God is

better God is good that’s sin that’s

just not great I don’t want to open this

door again i’ma turn imma flee do you

think back on your teenage years and

worry about your daughter yes I’m

terrified for her that’s all of us

though you know any of us that have kids

when I watch CNN I just don’t I don’t

like it

honestly because I feel like as a mother

it is going to be my job to convince her

that all that she sees is not reality

because it’s being promoted as if it is

trans

homosexuality and same-sex marriage and

all of this is promote like this is

normal I have to say Eden it’s not

normal it’s not okay though you see it

though they look happy you choose God

and that’s just going to be my job for

the rest of my life I think when are you

going to do that do you do you feel like

the younger the better in other words I

feel like there there are some

conversations when my kid was four and

I’m looking at my little teeny

four-year-old and I’m thinking do I

really want to have this conversation

with my four year you really can I wait

till they’re 12 you know maybe a little

bit later in life but you’re saying it’s

at four and five when really it would

have been beneficial to you for someone

to sit down and have this conversation

with you children are smarter than we

give that we know where kids are smart

you know and like how do you know that

you’re not going to open up a door

that’s not even open in their mind you

write a book about it cuz I don’t know

you should you read a book no oh you

should only four months sorry I don’t

know do you think that you’re going to

talk to her I don’t know I’m really

gonna seek counsel cuz I have no I’m

still learning about teething so I don’t

potty training is next on your list

yeah I’m Kendra but I don’t know but I

did want to add something about the

marriage part I think one of the things

that helped me become open with Preston

it wasn’t when I’ve started to love him

it wasn’t that I’m loving a man it was I

was loving Preston it’s hard to explain

it but it was just all that he was I

loved him and so that involved his

maleness and in say that again say that

again that’s really good all that he was

I loved and enjoyed and which involved

his maleness so I got past the beard

because I love Preston you know I got

past you you have to get asked some

things still do you have to kind of look

past some of that maleness that’s still

kind of my thing the

how do I say this without being

insulting he’s he leaves stuff out a lot

or doesn’t like wanna wash dishes just

look stuff that women when they come

over my house they just naturally do I

wash them dishes while you Jackie and I

like he doesn’t his petty things like

that that are just like he forgets

everything yet he knows all of the

sports stats and so it’s just like oh

we’re all in the same boat yeah it’s all

yeah how did you forget that you’re

supposed to make appointment but you you

know when Michael Jordan got every

single ring and where it was and at what

time you know stuff like that is a

little physically physically no not

anymore not anymore play that something

you had heard all you had to get over

initially when we would hug I wasn’t

used to a man I wasn’t used to somebody

holding my waist because I did that and

so it made me feel like feminine and so

that was just really weird that it’s

like oh I have to go above your

shoulders okay like it was as you had to

learn yeah either reteach my studied the

feminine be okay with being feminine are

you still trying to work on being okay

with being feminine I think I’m myself

now cuz I don’t wear dresses and purses

and nails and I thought I had to to be a

woman but that’s not true like what

makes you a woman that I served my

husband that I served my child that I

submit to church leadership that I’m

hospitable to guests that I love Jesus

that I I’m disciple another women and

trying to teach them how to be

homemakers and be okay with that trying

to practice meekness which is very

difficult for me because I’m not meek

everything that Titus 2 says not should

be praised

everything that Titus who says I should

be me seeking that out and trying to get

older women around me to help me grow in

that that’s what makes me a woman so ok

you your spare time when you’re not

teething and potty training and doing

those sorts of things you write poetry

yes and I want you to share one of those

with us the hole if they don’t mind sure

come on

you can stand you can sit whatever we

want to hear it I can’t remember the

first line Jesus um okay can I google it

y’all just edit it out yeah good yeah

maybe that person’s yeah Google the

first sentence we’ll edit it out goodbye

we want to hear it that’s why I love

YouTube you know yeah oh you’re gonna

you’re going to YouTube yourself so you

can hear the first yeah the first

sentence that’s all I need and I’m good

thank you for your patience guys oh

you’re welcome no worries don’t worry at

all I hope you can get a connection to

also tell

there we go I got it you got it tell me

those three words I literally just

needed that do you want me to look

somewhere um

just me them everybody okay yeah I find

it funny that women women that are

children of the Most High continued to

fall for lowlifes chasing after men that

have yet to find the maturity as quick

as they can find to help me please help

me understand I stand on the sidelines

watching my sisters who have hearts like

pillows with an addiction to

relationships and allergic reactions to

loneliness turn men into cocaine dying

to be strung out on love even if

separation from their true rock as a

result his hug could be their rehab his

wisdom would rescue them from relapses

but this Winehouse mentality got him so

drunk on denial that they could care

less that God actually knows what’s best

so they push them to the side to let the

moscato flesh make the decisions for

them women your impatience with

sovereignty has carved your eyesight

into an Eden of illusions seeing as

opposed to godliness in any and every

atom that walks past you blinded to the

worm swimming through his fruit the lust

preying how to go seeking his prey is a

symphony of pride resting in his swag of

his walk and like your heavenly dad and

run a man that’s get to learn how to be

led by the Spirit of God can I lead you

to anywhere but himself which would be

cool if yo boo was the source of all

comfort a stronghold of healing gonna

galaxy of peace with the power to turn

dust into us in a split second but only

God has that written on his resume at

how many of us have fired the same God

for a counterfeit Savior disregarding

the cross that was on God’s back to fix

your eyes on their wooden crucifix

hanging from a mere man’s neck so

desperate for a ring of metal to melt

into your hands you forgotten about the

nails crawling with raft that was

smashed into his Jesus will crown mangle

into thorns with our confused queens

have mistaken princes for the king of

Jews he was hung up for you slow hey go

bone dude I’m telling you that if your

search for love has stolen your

reverence for God then you were made a

modern-day bail out of a relationship a

diamond ring into a golden calf a God

out of a man that has to brawl his

breath from someone else I suggest you

steal back your heart for whatever man

that has a sitting on the same

table he plays cards with empty and all

beating with tears go back to the one

who was jealous for you and say here you

can have I apologize for giving

something you created away to someone

you created believing they would do

better with it than you I’m not standing

before you as one let stood face to face

with Satan’s razor blades the graces

with us women he’s working very hard to

distract our gaze of faith off the lover

of our souls so much that we rather

court then gets another judge but I’m

standing before you as one who was

striving to present her loneliness as a

gift to the heel of broken hearts

believing that he will make a Lazarus of

my pain a walking miracle of my past I

am suspending all that the world has

taught me about relationships to truly

believe that everything isn’t found in

men but everything is only found in him

I’m letting this pillow of a heart only

find comfort in Jesus believing that he

sincerely loves me so women when your

imagination tries to tell you that that

God will be your hero remind yourself

that Jesus is the only man that can save

you

50 beautiful thank you

it’s incredible story of surrender and

freedom we are so glad that you joined

us a lot of people are going to be

helped today because of your

authenticity and vulnerability you’re so

grateful for me thanks so much for

joining us we’ll see you next time

you